(For over-engineered, see the Mercedes W140: Double pane windows that would go back down if they encountered an obstruction, powered door closers on all doors as well as the trunk, a heater that could continue to warm the car even after the engine was shut down. Yeah, heads rolled in Stuttgart after a billion dollars was used to introduce that line.)
As to stick vs automatic; it's really a matter of personal preference. If it were me, I'd definately keep to stick on a W201. An automatic version offers little perfomance improvement over a stick 240D.
You should really test drive the W123 240D before counting it out. Maybe the power it delivers would be acceptable...?
You didn't mention why doing your own service was not an option. If it's due to a lack of knowledge or experience, then, one really great thing about the W123s, especially the 4-cylinder diesel models, is that they are sooo easy to work and learn mechanickin' on. Really, it doesn't get any simpler than a late-70's to mid-80's 240D. That and they're pert near bullet-proof to start with.
Have you considered the W124 300D? It has the 6-cylinder turbo-diesel, and can achieve over 30 mpg. Yeah, it's a bigger car than the W201, but, it competed in the same market as the Peugeot 505TD. "4-Matic", the four-wheel-drive system was available to compete wilth the "Quattro". The German ADAC put them at the top of the list for reliability in the upper middle class catagory. Only real problem is that this 300D was sold here in the US for a very short time, one or two years only.
Or the W126 300SDL? Same engine as the W124 300D. It's a big car, true, but the aerodynamics and improved fuel system can get you 30 mpg plus. We have a number of people on this list who just luu-uhv them.
(Funny how you liked the Peugeot 504s. I grew up in Peugeots in the '60s; 403s and, probably the best car they ever made, the 404s. It was after my father bought a brand new 504 in '72 that he declared, "No more Peugeots". The 504 just didn't measure up to it's predecessor: Too expensive to buy and maintain, too finicky, too unreliable.)
Mark in Lakewood, CO
From: "Andrew Buc" <andrewbuc@staxman.net>
To: "diesel mercedes" <diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2011 12:28:07 PM
Subject: [diesel_mercedes] W201 190D questions
No, I don't have my eye on a particular 190D yet. I'm trying to
decide whether I want one. In a nutshell, I'm seeking the usual
prospective car buyer information: reliability, running costs, parts
availability, all that good stuff.
Back story: My commute recently got much longer when my employer
moved, and I like my current house and neighborhood and don't care to
move. My finances don't run to a brand-new car. Maybe I can best
explain my interest in the W201 190D by explaining why I eliminated
other cars from the short list:
A1 or A2 VW Golf/Jetta: I don't think these are as crashworthy as I'd
like, and I'm concerned that most of them are pretty tired by now.
A3 or A4 Golf/Jetta TDI: My mechanic tells me that TDI's are
troublesome and expensive to fix. I also have the impression that you
can run only a small proportion of biodiesel in them, or you risk
trouble.
Peugeot 505TD: I had a couple of gas Peugeot 504's in the '90s and
liked them very much. If only Peugeot hadn't left the US market. :(
W123 240D: A bigger car than I need (W201 seems about the right
size), and I understand they're DOG slow. I have no illusions that
the 190D is a pavement ripper, and I've had (and been satisfied with)
cars that weren't hot rods, but I have the impression that the 240D
can hardly get out of its own way.
W123 300D, 300TD: Fuel mileage no better than my current Audi 4000
quattro, so little reason to switch.
For a 190D to be a reasonable proposition for me, it needs to be
reliable, not too expensive to run, with good parts availability,
both now and for the foreseeable future. Also, given my commute, I
can't afford a lot of downtime--when I need parts, I need them quickly.
I'm neither dirt poor nor filthy rich, and I've never had a real high-
maintenance car like an older Jaguar (I'd heard the horror stories!),
but I've also never had a super-reliable car like a Toyota. With the
exception of a couple of really troublesome cars, I've been OK with
this. I'm going to talk a bit about my experience with the Audi as a
yardstick of what I consider acceptable. In 68K miles (222K on it
now), the Audi has given me very little trouble, and it's never
stranded me. Most of the problems have been minor, and they haven't
made the car inoperable, but a couple of times I've been glad that I
live only a couple miles from the garage that services the car. A
while back the left front power window switch got a bit flaky--
sometimes worked, sometimes not. I had it replaced, along with the
right front switch, just in case. The switches were $67 each. More
recently, I had to replace the clutch pedal. The hole in the pedal
where the clutch linkage attaches had become elongated with wear (not
unreasonable in 200K miles), resulting in the clutch not quite
disengaging all the way. The replacement pedal was $150. (Quoted
prices don't include labor.) I thought these were rather spendy
parts, and I'm sure the same parts for, say, a Saturn SL, would be
cheaper. But to me, this is tolerable, as long as I need such
expensive parts only once in a great while. Some folks on the
Audfans.com listserve have 4000 quattros with 350K on them, so I
don't think the car is approaching the point where it constantly
breaks down. The clutch went out at 203K, but assuming that it was
the original clutch, I can't really complain!
Right now someone local to me is advertising a 190D on Craigslist
with 288K on it and saying that on a diesel, this mileage is nothing--
would you agree? Just to be clear, any purchase of a 190D would be a
ways off--I'm asking in general, not with this car in mind.
I've heard that routine maintenance on Mercedes is expensive, but
I've also heard anecdotally that the reputation for expensive
maintenance is overblown. Doing my own service isn't an option, but
my German-car mechanic has a very reasonable labor rate and is good
about finding cost-effective solutions. I once ran the idea of a 190D
past him, and he said, "They don't need much." If this statement
applies to both routine service and breakdown repairs, it's a good
sign. I've also heard that the W201 was the last really
overengineered Mercedes, which is good. Naturally I'd want to find a
car that the seller had owned for a long time and kept service
records on, but how much of a chance would I be taking if these
conditions weren't met? While we're on this, any thoughts on stick
vs. automatic?
Thanks for your thoughts.
