[diesel_mercedes] Re: Interesting alternator problem

 

A gut reaction . . . Just for fun check the glow plug relay and see if it is sticking on when it should be off. The glow plugs use more than the alternator can supply. So if they are not turning off when they should the symptoms you describe could be explained. Including passing the test at the FLAPS but still not charging the battery. Note: it may be an intermittent problem at this point. A temporary light wired to the tip of the #5 glow plug would work on either type of glow plug system.


-------- Original Message --------

Subject: Interesting alternator problem
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 21:08:06 -0500
From: Alan Boucher <alstheone@verizon.net>
To: diesel_mercedesl@yahoogroups.com


My 83 300D  has developed an interesting problem.  After 2 or three days 
of normal day and evening driving the battery dies.   The car is in NY 
and is driven 15 to 35 miles at a time.  The battery is approx. 1 Yr 
old.  Now the  red light is coming on.  with no load on the electrical 
system, clean battery and ground terminals, and a fully charged battery, 
it does dim somewhat with increasinng speed.   The local Autozone tested 
the alternator in the car and a spare and said that both were good.  I 
swapped out the alternator with the spare, one of my favorite jobs on 
this car, with the same result.  I checked the brushes in the voltage 
regulator and cleaned the commutators on the spare before I put it in.  
The only thing that I  can't verify is that the voltage regulator is 
working properly.  My next step is to change the voltage regulator.   I 
have  another alternator that was working when the car was wrecked, but 
its under a couple of feet of snow.  Does anyone have any suggestions?

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

[diesel_mercedes] CB Richard Ellis - Honda Test Track | Cantil, CA

 

http://www.cbre.com/USA/US/CA/South Bay LA/Property/hondatesttrack.htm?pageid=0
Looks like fun to me .

-Nate

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

Re: [diesel_mercedes] Fwd: Interesting alternator problem

 

Had the same problem with my 73 Dodge PU. Everything tested ok but on
the truck there was no charging. All circuits checked out for
"continuity" buttttttttttttttttttttttttttt what I didn't know was the
wire to energize the field coil was hanging by one strand of wire. It
would have continuity but could not pass enough amps to energize the
field coil. Possible????
--
Stan George Portland <<

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

[diesel_mercedes] 1980 300D parts.

 

There is a juy on the main drag at Quartzsite with a parted out 300D has motor trans, & other parts, window winders brake booster etc No body parts. PM me reall quick and I will see if he has anything you need. We will be leaving here soon but will try & connect you up with him. His yard is a mess so don't get your hopes up too high.
Tony

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

Re: [diesel_mercedes] Fwd: Interesting alternator problem

 

On 1/11/2011 9:52 PM, audiolaw@aol.com wrote:

 

In a message dated 1/11/2011 6:37:51 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, alstheone@verizon.net writes:
 



-------- Original Message --------

Subject: Interesting alternator problem
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 21:08:06 -0500
From: Alan Boucher <alstheone@verizon.net>
To: diesel_mercedesl@yahoogroups.com 


My 83 300D  has developed an interesting problem.  After 2 or three days  of normal day and evening driving the battery dies.   The car is in NY  and is driven 15 to 35 miles at a time.  The battery is approx. 1 Yr  old.  Now the  red light is coming on.  with no load on the electrical  system, clean battery and ground terminals, and a fully charged battery,  it does dim somewhat with increasinng speed.   The local Autozone tested  the alternator in the car and a spare and said that both were good.  I  swapped out the alternator with the spare, one of my favorite jobs on  this car, with the same result.  I checked the brushes in the voltage  regulator and cleaned the commutators on the spare before I put it in.   The only thing that I can't verify is that the voltage regulator is  working properly.  My next step is to change the voltage regulator.   I  have  another alternator that was working when the car was wrecked, but  its under a couple of feet of snow.  Does anyone have any suggestions?
 
    I suggest that you NOT check the regulator or do any swapping, YET. 
 
    Assume for the time being that Autozone is right, that the alternator is OK.  Then you want to find out if the unit is charging IN CIRCUIT and if it's charging the battery. 
 
    If the red light is coming on, it is telling you that the electrical system is seeing drain, rather than charge.  Find out why.  With the engine running OVER idle speed (not much over), use a simple VOM to measure what the voltage output of the alternator is.  It should be over 13 vdc. 
 
    If it is over 13 vdc, then measure the voltage across the battery terminals, it should be essentially the same as the alternator output.  If it is NOT, then you have a wiring problem. 
 
    With the engine OFF, is the battery being drained?  How do you know?  Lift the + terminal cable.  Connect a test light between the + terminal and the cable.  Does it light?  If so, you have a significant drain. 
 
    Find the drain by pulling fuses, one at a time, and see which one stops the drain. 
 
    None of this is brain surgery - much more like rocket science, simple steps of isolating the source of problems, one at a time, to see where you have trouble. 
 
    On this car, you can suffer problems with corrosion where major cables run and interconnect.  You may have a really simple cleaing problem to deal with.  Look in the archives for Nate's design for an improved grounding cable set up.  His design was essentially done to address similar problems in charging. 
 
Tom 
 
 
 
Thanks, I haven't measured voltages yet.  I did check for current draw with everything off.  I was showing .00 to .01 amps between the battery and the cable.  Opening the door increased the reading to approx .7 amps when the interior light came on.   I'll move on to chasing wiring.

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

Re: [diesel_mercedes] Fwd: Interesting alternator problem

 

In a message dated 1/11/2011 6:37:51 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, alstheone@verizon.net writes:
 



-------- Original Message --------

Subject: Interesting alternator problem
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 21:08:06 -0500
From: Alan Boucher <alstheone@verizon.net>
To: diesel_mercedesl@yahoogroups.com


My 83 300D  has developed an interesting problem.  After 2 or three days  of normal day and evening driving the battery dies.   The car is in NY  and is driven 15 to 35 miles at a time.  The battery is approx. 1 Yr  old.  Now the  red light is coming on.  with no load on the electrical  system, clean battery and ground terminals, and a fully charged battery,  it does dim somewhat with increasinng speed.   The local Autozone tested  the alternator in the car and a spare and said that both were good.  I  swapped out the alternator with the spare, one of my favorite jobs on  this car, with the same result.  I checked the brushes in the voltage  regulator and cleaned the commutators on the spare before I put it in.   The only thing that I can't verify is that the voltage regulator is  working properly.  My next step is to change the voltage regulator.   I  have  another alternator that was working when the car was wrecked, but  its under a couple of feet of snow.  Does anyone have any suggestions?
 
    I suggest that you NOT check the regulator or do any swapping, YET. 
 
    Assume for the time being that Autozone is right, that the alternator is OK.  Then you want to find out if the unit is charging IN CIRCUIT and if it's charging the battery. 
 
    If the red light is coming on, it is telling you that the electrical system is seeing drain, rather than charge.  Find out why.  With the engine running OVER idle speed (not much over), use a simple VOM to measure what the voltage output of the alternator is.  It should be over 13 vdc. 
 
    If it is over 13 vdc, then measure the voltage across the battery terminals, it should be essentially the same as the alternator output.  If it is NOT, then you have a wiring problem. 
 
    With the engine OFF, is the battery being drained?  How do you know?  Lift the + terminal cable.  Connect a test light between the + terminal and the cable.  Does it light?  If so, you have a significant drain. 
 
    Find the drain by pulling fuses, one at a time, and see which one stops the drain. 
 
    None of this is brain surgery - much more like rocket science, simple steps of isolating the source of problems, one at a time, to see where you have trouble. 
 
    On this car, you can suffer problems with corrosion where major cables run and interconnect.  You may have a really simple cleaing problem to deal with.  Look in the archives for Nate's design for an improved grounding cable set up.  His design was essentially done to address similar problems in charging. 
 
Tom 
 
 
 

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

[diesel_mercedes] Fwd: Interesting alternator problem

 



-------- Original Message --------

Subject: Interesting alternator problem
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 21:08:06 -0500
From: Alan Boucher <alstheone@verizon.net>
To: diesel_mercedesl@yahoogroups.com 


My 83 300D  has developed an interesting problem.  After 2 or three days  of normal day and evening driving the battery dies.   The car is in NY  and is driven 15 to 35 miles at a time.  The battery is approx. 1 Yr  old.  Now the  red light is coming on.  with no load on the electrical  system, clean battery and ground terminals, and a fully charged battery,  it does dim somewhat with increasinng speed.   The local Autozone tested  the alternator in the car and a spare and said that both were good.  I  swapped out the alternator with the spare, one of my favorite jobs on  this car, with the same result.  I checked the brushes in the voltage  regulator and cleaned the commutators on the spare before I put it in.   The only thing that I can't verify is that the voltage regulator is  working properly.  My next step is to change the voltage regulator.   I  have  another alternator that was working when the car was wrecked, but  its under a couple of feet of snow.  Does anyone have any suggestions?

__._,_.___
Recent Activity:
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

Re: [diesel_mercedes] Sylvia - 1983 300 SD - Major maintenance down under - "glowing" results (so far)

 

You spent some serious money didn't you!
 
brian from la verne, ca


From: Barton <barton.fiske@gmail.com>
To: diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, January 10, 2011 4:25:15 PM
Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Sylvia - 1983 300 SD - Major maintenance down under - "glowing" results (so far)

 

Last week, Sylvia went in to the shop for new glow plugs, to diagnose front end wobble on decel from 65-40 and the ongoing exorcism of
the electrical demons.

See my new Yahoo diesel_mercedes photo album for Sylvia here:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/diesel_mercedes/photos/album/614318898/pic/2128952407/view

Final repair and parts list includes:

Remove/replace new (rebuilt) steering box (did not go seal kit route)
2x tie rods
2x ball joints
2x control arms
Idler arm rebuild kit
2x fuel filters
5x new glow plugs
1x power steering reservoir seal
1x bosch voltage regulator - inspect wire harness, clean as needed

oil change + filter
high speed balance 4x new Michelins on 16" rims
alignment
MA State inspection

Due to (ahem) budgetary constraints, had to stop here:

still to be done:

turbo is (still) venting oil into the air cleaner implying
bad/warn turbo? anyone want to guesstimate parts/labor for
this task?

Car now drives like it's on rails (again). Still
accelerates like a 250,000 year old dog but started
like a brand new car @ 23F (not sure how "warm" it
was when I picked it up at the shop, engine temp was below 40C).

Headlights still fluctuate (as they always did) at
reduced/increased revs, but all systems (interior, radio,
climate control, turn signals, etc) stayed on and acted
normal (so far) on 10 mi ride home.

Car passed inspection (again) on first attempt.

Hopefully all you'll hear from me soon enough will
be silence (on these topics....)

As to my request for locks/keys - the reason
I'm looking for replacements is that I don't have
the VIN # for the car they came from, (they are not
original - I don't know why) so there's no new keys to make.

Will be dragging a magnet in the gear selector
black hole for sure tomorrow...who knows, maybe
the key gremlins will yield the Ring that binds
them all... :^)

-Barton


__._,_.___
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

[diesel_mercedes] xlation - Re: '84 300 SD: Wanted: driver/passgr locks w/ key (or at least VIN

 


Thanks Nate - I agree that should work. Although there aren't many whole cars left in the local PAP's, I'll bet the door inventory may still be pretty good. Perhaps I can get a drvr/pax door handle a little easier than I thought. In the mean time, if anyone has the below inventory, I should be good to go on this topic. :^)

-Barton

--- In diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com, "Nate" <vwnate1@...> wrote:
>
>
> O.K. Barton ;
>
> Go get a cheap spare outside door handle and take the lock cylinder out of it , take that and your ignition key to the local locksmith and ask him to make the cylinder match they key ~ this should be $40 if he's honest , if he hesitates in any way , leave and find another locksmith .
>
> This is the easy way IMO , gets you back to square one where you belong as the ign. key still matches the VIN.....
>
> I had this done to the trunk lock of my old red Coupe when the original one died .
>
> I need to have it done to my other red Coupe's trunk lock as it's also dying and hard to get the key to unlock it .
>
> BTW :I had *no* trouble understanding your initial request for matching door handles & trunk lock with key...
>
> -Nate
> Barton wrote:
> >
> > oops - I see how this thread needs some more context to execute..
> >
> > so....the car came with the following key/lock "features"..
> >
> > 2x ignition keys that start the car and match the vin of the car it starts
> >
> > 2x trunk keys that fit the rear trunk and is my only means of locking anything
> > valuable in the car at present and may or may not match the VIN of Sylvia
> > but probably not and only the PO or the PPO (or their mechanic(s) might know).
> >
> > 1x drvr/pax door key and 2x salvage locks/tumblers installed by PO who
> > doesn't know VIN ofthe car those locks
> >
> > As sold, the car came to me w/ two rings of keys:
> >
> > Ring 1: Ignition key #1 + the drv/pax door key + trunk key #1
> >
> > Ring 2: Ignition key #2 + trunk key #2
> >
> > Rumored to be lost forever in the den of inequity that is my garage and first
> > floor basement is Ring 1, with now no way to lock the doors and no VIN to tell
> > Mercedes how to recut the keys for that lock. Prevailing domestic theory is that
> > the keys somehow fell into the black hole from which the gear selector emanates
> > and they are slowly settling their way into the bowels of the car. If anyone has
> > lost something in there before and knows how to retrieve it, or even how big that
> > space is, please expound forthwith. I have proved with bright light and see nothing
> > but really long for one of those fiber optic cameras on a flexistick for just such an occasion.
> >
> > Previous queries to this forum have indicated that in the case of Mercedes
> > keys, unless you either have a copy of the key or the VIN # of the car the
> > key was delivered with, one is SOL w/r/t to getting a key cut for that lock
> > for a fair buck (given any motivated locksmith could probably cut a key
> > given full access to the tumbler/mechanism).
> >
> > As before, if you gots 'em, I need 'em.
> >
> > 1984 300SD
> > 2x lock cylinders (drvr/pax doors)
> > 1x working (ideally original) matching key
> >
> > cheers,
> >
> > -Barton
> >
>

__._,_.___
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

Re: [diesel_mercedes] Re: Sylvia - 1983 300 SD - Major maintenance down under - "glowing" results (so far)

 

On 1/11/2011 11:45 AM, Barton wrote:

 

Thanks for the comments about the turbo and source of oil, I'm beginning to think I may need to add a new vacuum pump to the list as well. The shop I go to will do almost anything mechanical that's the same as a gasser, but has specifically declined to work on the vacuum system - so I'll be going to a shop I know that specializes in Mercedes Benz, or to back to the dealer (they said they "liked" my funky old car).

As to why the photo album shows an engine out of the car, that was just for background context. The repairs I posted below did not require removing the engine - thank goodness!!

Have put another 30 miles or so on Sylvia in the dark - I think we're back to reliable operation.....it was about 20 degrees F all night last night, going to see if she starts any easier with the new glow plugs....lots of snow coming our way tomorrow...will need to be able to move her around when it comes time to shovel....

-Barton

--- In diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com, Mark in Lakewood CO <beeser750@...> wrote:
>
>
> Mine collected a lot of oil at the U-shaped intake tube between the air filter housing and the turbo, but, that was caused by a blown diaphram in the vacuum pump.
>
> Mark in Lakewood, CO
>
> To: diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com
> From: vwnate1@...
> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 04:35:23 +0000
> Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Re: Sylvia - 1983 300 SD - Major maintenance down under - "glowing" results (so far)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Engine out & on the ground (pic #2) ?? why ? .
>
>
>
> The turbo sucks air out of the air cleaner , not spits it in .
>
>
>
> As long as it runs well , keep it regularly serviced (valve adjustments & _HOT_ oil & filter changes) and it should be fine .
>
>
>
> Oil in the air cleaner was a problem from near new , Mercedes tweaked the crankcase vent numerous times to deal with this , I just wipe it clean any time I'm servicing the car , since my engine overhaul , the air cleaner hardly gets any oil mist in it .
>
>
>
> -Nate
>
> Barton wrote:
>
> >
>
> > Last week, Sylvia went in to the shop for new glow plugs, to diagnose front end wobble on decel from 65-40 and the ongoing exorcism of
>
> > the electrical demons.
>
> >
>
> > See my new Yahoo diesel_mercedes photo album for Sylvia here:
>
> >
>
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/diesel_mercedes/photos/album/614318898/pic/2128952407/view
>
> >
>
> > Final repair and parts list includes:
>
> >
>
> > Remove/replace new (rebuilt) steering box (did not go seal kit route)
>
> > 2x tie rods
>
> > 2x ball joints
>
> > 2x control arms
>
> > Idler arm rebuild kit
>
> > 2x fuel filters
>
> > 5x new glow plugs
>
> > 1x power steering reservoir seal
>
> > 1x bosch voltage regulator - inspect wire harness, clean as needed
>
> >
>
> > oil change + filter
>
> > high speed balance 4x new Michelins on 16" rims
>
> > alignment
>
> > MA State inspection
>
> >
>
> > Due to (ahem) budgetary constraints, had to stop here:
>
> >
>
> > still to be done:
>
> >
>
> > turbo is (still) venting oil into the air cleaner implying
>
> > bad/warn turbo? anyone want to guesstimate parts/labor for
>
> > this task?
>
> >
>
> > Car now drives like it's on rails (again). Still
>
> > accelerates like a 250,000 year old dog but started
>
> > like a brand new car @ 23F (not sure how "warm" it
>
> > was when I picked it up at the shop, engine temp was below 40C).
>
> >
>
> > Headlights still fluctuate (as they always did) at
>
> > reduced/increased revs, but all systems (interior, radio,
>
> > climate control, turn signals, etc) stayed on and acted
>
> > normal (so far) on 10 mi ride home.
>
> >
>
> > Car passed inspection (again) on first attempt.
>
> >
>
> > Hopefully all you'll hear from me soon enough will
>
> > be silence (on these topics....)
>
> >
>
> > As to my request for locks/keys - the reason
>
> > I'm looking for replacements is that I don't have
>
> > the VIN # for the car they came from, (they are not
>
> > original - I don't know why) so there's no new keys to make.
>
> >
>
> > Will be dragging a magnet in the gear selector
>
> > black hole for sure tomorrow...who knows, maybe
>
> > the key gremlins will yield the Ring that binds
>
> > them all... :^)
>
> >
>
> > -Barton
>
> >
>

If I were a dealer's repair shop, I'd like your funky old car to. 

__._,_.___
.

__,_._,___
No comments:

[diesel_mercedes] Re: Sylvia - 1983 300 SD - Major maintenance down under - "glowing" results (so far)

 

Thanks for the comments about the turbo and source of oil, I'm beginning to think I may need to add a new vacuum pump to the list as well. The shop I go to will do almost anything mechanical that's the same as a gasser, but has specifically declined to work on the vacuum system - so I'll be going to a shop I know that specializes in Mercedes Benz, or to back to the dealer (they said they "liked" my funky old car).

As to why the photo album shows an engine out of the car, that was just for background context. The repairs I posted below did not require removing the engine - thank goodness!!

Have put another 30 miles or so on Sylvia in the dark - I think we're back to reliable operation.....it was about 20 degrees F all night last night, going to see if she starts any easier with the new glow plugs....lots of snow coming our way tomorrow...will need to be able to move her around when it comes time to shovel....

-Barton

--- In diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com, Mark in Lakewood CO <beeser750@...> wrote:
>
>
> Mine collected a lot of oil at the U-shaped intake tube between the air filter housing and the turbo, but, that was caused by a blown diaphram in the vacuum pump.
>
> Mark in Lakewood, CO
>
> To: diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com
> From: vwnate1@...
> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 04:35:23 +0000
> Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Re: Sylvia - 1983 300 SD - Major maintenance down under - "glowing" results (so far)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Engine out & on the ground (pic #2) ?? why ? .
>
>
>
> The turbo sucks air out of the air cleaner , not spits it in .
>
>
>
> As long as it runs well , keep it regularly serviced (valve adjustments & _HOT_ oil & filter changes) and it should be fine .
>
>
>
> Oil in the air cleaner was a problem from near new , Mercedes tweaked the crankcase vent numerous times to deal with this , I just wipe it clean any time I'm servicing the car , since my engine overhaul , the air cleaner hardly gets any oil mist in it .
>
>
>
> -Nate
>
> Barton wrote:
>
> >
>
> > Last week, Sylvia went in to the shop for new glow plugs, to diagnose front end wobble on decel from 65-40 and the ongoing exorcism of
>
> > the electrical demons.
>
> >
>
> > See my new Yahoo diesel_mercedes photo album for Sylvia here:
>
> >
>
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/diesel_mercedes/photos/album/614318898/pic/2128952407/view
>
> >
>
> > Final repair and parts list includes:
>
> >
>
> > Remove/replace new (rebuilt) steering box (did not go seal kit route)
>
> > 2x tie rods
>
> > 2x ball joints
>
> > 2x control arms
>
> > Idler arm rebuild kit
>
> > 2x fuel filters
>
> > 5x new glow plugs
>
> > 1x power steering reservoir seal
>
> > 1x bosch voltage regulator - inspect wire harness, clean as needed
>
> >
>
> > oil change + filter
>
> > high speed balance 4x new Michelins on 16" rims
>
> > alignment
>
> > MA State inspection
>
> >
>
> > Due to (ahem) budgetary constraints, had to stop here:
>
> >
>
> > still to be done:
>
> >
>
> > turbo is (still) venting oil into the air cleaner implying
>
> > bad/warn turbo? anyone want to guesstimate parts/labor for
>
> > this task?
>
> >
>
> > Car now drives like it's on rails (again). Still
>
> > accelerates like a 250,000 year old dog but started
>
> > like a brand new car @ 23F (not sure how "warm" it
>
> > was when I picked it up at the shop, engine temp was below 40C).
>
> >
>
> > Headlights still fluctuate (as they always did) at
>
> > reduced/increased revs, but all systems (interior, radio,
>
> > climate control, turn signals, etc) stayed on and acted
>
> > normal (so far) on 10 mi ride home.
>
> >
>
> > Car passed inspection (again) on first attempt.
>
> >
>
> > Hopefully all you'll hear from me soon enough will
>
> > be silence (on these topics....)
>
> >
>
> > As to my request for locks/keys - the reason
>
> > I'm looking for replacements is that I don't have
>
> > the VIN # for the car they came from, (they are not
>
> > original - I don't know why) so there's no new keys to make.
>
> >
>
> > Will be dragging a magnet in the gear selector
>
> > black hole for sure tomorrow...who knows, maybe
>
> > the key gremlins will yield the Ring that binds
>
> > them all... :^)
>
> >
>
> > -Barton
>
> >
>

__._,_.___
.

__,_._,___
No comments:
Subscribe to: Posts (Atom)