Re: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines

 

Mike,


Agreed - done right - WVO works and keeps on working.

Bobby

On Thu, Jul 25, 2013 at 11:07 PM, Mike Glavin <magconsulting2@yahoo.com> wrote:


I agree. I was assuming temp was a given. I also mentioned that i didn't switch to wvo until engine coolant was at full temp. Keep in mind, the oil in the veg tank is being heated to coolant temp (near 190 or so on a Mercedes). My wvo fuel line runs up to the engine with the coolant hoses all encased in a heavy rubber sheath similar to inner tube rubber, so even in winter the fuel line is sandwiched between two hot coolant hoses inside a big rubber tube. Arguably there can be some temp loss along the way but you started at 190 plus. The pump is pretty hot and if you have rebuilt any injectors you know how small those passages are so not much veg is entering the injector.  Those injectors are pretty toasty also, so I imagine any lost temp along the way is made up pretty quick and then some. I have the heated wires on my injector lines also but rarely use them. Usually they are just to get the veg near regular coolant temp in the winter because it can take longer in winter to get the coolant up to 190. I can affirm right now that the 190 coolant circulating through my wvo tank keeps you from putting your hand on it. It's as hot as the radiator. 
If you were sucking unheated veg from the trunk, it would still be well over 100 by the time it goes through IP and especially the injectors themselves (unless winter). But your correct, without something like coolant or electric, it's not going to get the 160-180 to prevent coking. Again, I started these replies just to give my opinion that if done correctly, wvo is not likely to cut a Mercedes engine life by much, if at all.  I got my 82 300d for $1,700 with about 160,000 on the clock. What if wvo did trash it in another 100,000 or less, which I don't think it will, I have still saved thousands over diesel. 100,000 divided by 25 mpg = 4,000 gal x$3.75 gal = $15,000. : )


Mike Glavin


On Jul 25, 2013, at 9:22 PM, Bobby Yates Emory <liberty1@gmail.com> wrote:

 

Mike,

I agree with most of your points.


But I think there is another root cause for engine failures:

You said:

"The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. "

I think those could cause problems.  But there is another stumbling block - the oil must be low enough viscosity to allow the injector to fully vaporize the fuel.  If the fuel is not vaporized thoroughly, the engine will coke up.  At room temperature, the oil will be much more viscous than pump diesel.  By heating the oil, we can lower its viscosity to that of Diesel.   Some people say the oil should be 140F entering the injector pump.  Some people say 160F.  By getting to these elevated temps, we make sure the injector can produce the spray pattern we want.

Some people put heaters on the tubes going to the injectors, to get one last chance to raise the temperature of the oil before it gets to the injector.

To repeat, I feel that even if you have perfectly clean oil, it will not burn properly if it enters the injector at 90F.

(To be sure, the temp at the injector should be high.  Whether higher temps help the injection pump or not is another question.  I don't have an opinion.)

(Reality note: if we could re-engineer the injection pump and/or the injector, that might be a way to properly atomize the oil, but it is easier for us to raise the oil temperature than to change the pump or injector.)

Bobby

On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 9:45 PM, Mag <magconsulting2@yahoo.com> wrote:


I didn't intend to start a debate, but its more than what you can see in the oil. Clear does not mean best. Most older diesels are tough enough you can do whatever you want. Get any oil you want, strain through some jeans, run 24/7, start and stop on it, etc., and you still may get 200,000 this way. Then again, you may not. My post was to simply dispute the "WVO will kill a motor" claims, or decrease the number of miles the motor could have given you. The better you do it, the more miles you likely get. Just like with any other car maintenance.

For anyone interested, (I was interested), there is a lot of physics that go into this. Just like not changing oil every 2,500 miles 40 years ago would likely decrease engine life due to sludge, etc.  Oil technology has improved to the point they are now recommending 5,000 to 7,500, and more on synthetic.

One example;

Common physics proves that when your heat exchanger in your veg tank (mine just a trans cooler attached to heater hoses) gets veg up to 180 (or near whatever your engine coolant temp is) the constant heating and then cooling down when you turn engine off, causes moisture build up in your "clean, settled, de-moistured, or centrifuged" veg again. For this reason I have a 6 gal boat tank as the veg tank. At around 25 miles per gal, I carry 1 extra 5 gal container and refill every other day. Not that many heat up and cool downs before the 6 gal is gone. No 15 or 20 gal tank to linger and collect moisture. Plus, my 5 micron filter near the engine is rated to trap moisture. I have taken longer trips with 3 or 4, 5 gal plastic gas tanks with me. Stopping every 150 miles to refill the tank didn't kill me. 

The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. This freezes the rings in place which then scores cylinder walls, then comes the blow by. Similar issues with bearings, etc. i know I'm preaching to the choir. you can take crystal clear veg, add various chemicals like mineral spirits, turpentine, etc., and that will bind to some of that "invisible stuff" and settle to the bottom of the jar. Then ask yourself "where did that stuff come from".

Best way to avoid this as much as possible is "good veg", no moisture, and as much "bad stuff" filtered as possible, and that's not always what you can "see". I have been studying this stuff for 10 years and the one thing I'm certain of is a million people have a thousand different ways and spend countless hours debating such.  My way with the cent is fairly quick, simple, reasonably backed by science, and most importantly, works for me. Just thought I would share.

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:15 PM, Boyd Wright <bgthegreat@verizon.net> wrote:

 

I use coffee filters and denim cold.  Have a solar holding tank.  No problems here.
 
Boyd

From: Lawrence Rhodes <primobassoon@sbcglobal.net>
To: "diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com" <diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 1:09 PM
Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines
 
Now Mike has a real great setup but he is doing one thing wrong.  To speed things up he heats the oil...WRONG.  The problem with heating the oil is more "stuff" gets through.  I've had many a settled highly heated and refined five gallon jug of oil have silt on the bottom.  Heating while filtering allows more through the filter media.  I cold filter through denim.  I get very little silting after letting filtered oil sit.  If I worry about water I just don't use it.  Settling gets rid of most of the water.  My oil looks crystal clear.  If it's foggy I just don't use it or much of it.  Lawrence Rhodes........ Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines    Posted by: "Mike Glavin" magconsulting2@yahoo.com magconsulting2    Date: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:58 am ((PDT))I too have run veg oil and believe it to be as good as diesel if done right. Mine is run through a centrifuge that claims to filter out particles less than a micron. Regular oil filters are only about 25 microns. It has an engine coolant heat exchanger in the spare tank in the trunk  and a electric heated 5 micron filter before it enters the injectors. I start on diesel and don't switch over until engine coolant is at full temp. About a minute or so before I get to where I'm going, I switch back to diesel to flush the injectors. The 82 300D runs better on veg than diesel. Probably because the cetane level in veg is generally better than diesel. My cost is what ever I pay for the veg and electric for a 2 hour run of a 1/2 hp elect motor and single water heater element per 55 gallons cleaned. Centrifuge is mounted on top on 55 gal barrel. Veg is pumped from the bottom into the cent at 90 psi via the motor. Heating element is inserted into the side of drum with a similar threaded port as a water heater. I have it on a 220 cable that plugs into my dryer outlet. I pick up the veg. Pour through a strainer as I fill the drum. When full I plug in the heater. Come back in about an hour and if it 180-200 deg, I unplug heat and turn on the pump. Come back in 2 hours which equals about 4 passes of oil through the cent. The temp cooks off moisture and thins the oil so dirt can be spun out in the cent. 55 gal of near see through oil no matter the color going in. Unscrew the cover to the cent, wipe out the sludge with a shop rag, good to go another drum. Not counting pickup, about 20 min invested per 55 galMike Glavin573-338-6539






--
Toward freedom,

Bobby Yates Emory






--
Toward freedom,

Bobby Yates Emory

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Re: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines

 

I agree. I was assuming temp was a given. I also mentioned that i didn't switch to wvo until engine coolant was at full temp. Keep in mind, the oil in the veg tank is being heated to coolant temp (near 190 or so on a Mercedes). My wvo fuel line runs up to the engine with the coolant hoses all encased in a heavy rubber sheath similar to inner tube rubber, so even in winter the fuel line is sandwiched between two hot coolant hoses inside a big rubber tube. Arguably there can be some temp loss along the way but you started at 190 plus. The pump is pretty hot and if you have rebuilt any injectors you know how small those passages are so not much veg is entering the injector.  Those injectors are pretty toasty also, so I imagine any lost temp along the way is made up pretty quick and then some. I have the heated wires on my injector lines also but rarely use them. Usually they are just to get the veg near regular coolant temp in the winter because it can take longer in winter to get the coolant up to 190. I can affirm right now that the 190 coolant circulating through my wvo tank keeps you from putting your hand on it. It's as hot as the radiator. 
If you were sucking unheated veg from the trunk, it would still be well over 100 by the time it goes through IP and especially the injectors themselves (unless winter). But your correct, without something like coolant or electric, it's not going to get the 160-180 to prevent coking. Again, I started these replies just to give my opinion that if done correctly, wvo is not likely to cut a Mercedes engine life by much, if at all.  I got my 82 300d for $1,700 with about 160,000 on the clock. What if wvo did trash it in another 100,000 or less, which I don't think it will, I have still saved thousands over diesel. 100,000 divided by 25 mpg = 4,000 gal x$3.75 gal = $15,000. : )


Mike Glavin


On Jul 25, 2013, at 9:22 PM, Bobby Yates Emory <liberty1@gmail.com> wrote:

 

Mike,

I agree with most of your points.


But I think there is another root cause for engine failures:

You said:

"The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. "

I think those could cause problems.  But there is another stumbling block - the oil must be low enough viscosity to allow the injector to fully vaporize the fuel.  If the fuel is not vaporized thoroughly, the engine will coke up.  At room temperature, the oil will be much more viscous than pump diesel.  By heating the oil, we can lower its viscosity to that of Diesel.   Some people say the oil should be 140F entering the injector pump.  Some people say 160F.  By getting to these elevated temps, we make sure the injector can produce the spray pattern we want.

Some people put heaters on the tubes going to the injectors, to get one last chance to raise the temperature of the oil before it gets to the injector.

To repeat, I feel that even if you have perfectly clean oil, it will not burn properly if it enters the injector at 90F.

(To be sure, the temp at the injector should be high.  Whether higher temps help the injection pump or not is another question.  I don't have an opinion.)

(Reality note: if we could re-engineer the injection pump and/or the injector, that might be a way to properly atomize the oil, but it is easier for us to raise the oil temperature than to change the pump or injector.)

Bobby

On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 9:45 PM, Mag <magconsulting2@yahoo.com> wrote:


I didn't intend to start a debate, but its more than what you can see in the oil. Clear does not mean best. Most older diesels are tough enough you can do whatever you want. Get any oil you want, strain through some jeans, run 24/7, start and stop on it, etc., and you still may get 200,000 this way. Then again, you may not. My post was to simply dispute the "WVO will kill a motor" claims, or decrease the number of miles the motor could have given you. The better you do it, the more miles you likely get. Just like with any other car maintenance.

For anyone interested, (I was interested), there is a lot of physics that go into this. Just like not changing oil every 2,500 miles 40 years ago would likely decrease engine life due to sludge, etc.  Oil technology has improved to the point they are now recommending 5,000 to 7,500, and more on synthetic.

One example;

Common physics proves that when your heat exchanger in your veg tank (mine just a trans cooler attached to heater hoses) gets veg up to 180 (or near whatever your engine coolant temp is) the constant heating and then cooling down when you turn engine off, causes moisture build up in your "clean, settled, de-moistured, or centrifuged" veg again. For this reason I have a 6 gal boat tank as the veg tank. At around 25 miles per gal, I carry 1 extra 5 gal container and refill every other day. Not that many heat up and cool downs before the 6 gal is gone. No 15 or 20 gal tank to linger and collect moisture. Plus, my 5 micron filter near the engine is rated to trap moisture. I have taken longer trips with 3 or 4, 5 gal plastic gas tanks with me. Stopping every 150 miles to refill the tank didn't kill me. 

The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. This freezes the rings in place which then scores cylinder walls, then comes the blow by. Similar issues with bearings, etc. i know I'm preaching to the choir. you can take crystal clear veg, add various chemicals like mineral spirits, turpentine, etc., and that will bind to some of that "invisible stuff" and settle to the bottom of the jar. Then ask yourself "where did that stuff come from".

Best way to avoid this as much as possible is "good veg", no moisture, and as much "bad stuff" filtered as possible, and that's not always what you can "see". I have been studying this stuff for 10 years and the one thing I'm certain of is a million people have a thousand different ways and spend countless hours debating such.  My way with the cent is fairly quick, simple, reasonably backed by science, and most importantly, works for me. Just thought I would share.

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:15 PM, Boyd Wright <bgthegreat@verizon.net> wrote:

 

I use coffee filters and denim cold.  Have a solar holding tank.  No problems here.
 
Boyd

From: Lawrence Rhodes <primobassoon@sbcglobal.net>
To: "diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com" <diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 1:09 PM
Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines
 
Now Mike has a real great setup but he is doing one thing wrong.  To speed things up he heats the oil...WRONG.  The problem with heating the oil is more "stuff" gets through.  I've had many a settled highly heated and refined five gallon jug of oil have silt on the bottom.  Heating while filtering allows more through the filter media.  I cold filter through denim.  I get very little silting after letting filtered oil sit.  If I worry about water I just don't use it.  Settling gets rid of most of the water.  My oil looks crystal clear.  If it's foggy I just don't use it or much of it.  Lawrence Rhodes........ Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines    Posted by: "Mike Glavin" magconsulting2@yahoo.com magconsulting2    Date: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:58 am ((PDT))I too have run veg oil and believe it to be as good as diesel if done right. Mine is run through a centrifuge that claims to filter out particles less than a micron. Regular oil filters are only about 25 microns. It has an engine coolant heat exchanger in the spare tank in the trunk  and a electric heated 5 micron filter before it enters the injectors. I start on diesel and don't switch over until engine coolant is at full temp. About a minute or so before I get to where I'm going, I switch back to diesel to flush the injectors. The 82 300D runs better on veg than diesel. Probably because the cetane level in veg is generally better than diesel. My cost is what ever I pay for the veg and electric for a 2 hour run of a 1/2 hp elect motor and single water heater element per 55 gallons cleaned. Centrifuge is mounted on top on 55 gal barrel. Veg is pumped from the bottom into the cent at 90 psi via the motor. Heating element is inserted into the side of drum with a similar threaded port as a water heater. I have it on a 220 cable that plugs into my dryer outlet. I pick up the veg. Pour through a strainer as I fill the drum. When full I plug in the heater. Come back in about an hour and if it 180-200 deg, I unplug heat and turn on the pump. Come back in 2 hours which equals about 4 passes of oil through the cent. The temp cooks off moisture and thins the oil so dirt can be spun out in the cent. 55 gal of near see through oil no matter the color going in. Unscrew the cover to the cent, wipe out the sludge with a shop rag, good to go another drum. Not counting pickup, about 20 min invested per 55 galMike Glavin573-338-6539






--
Toward freedom,

Bobby Yates Emory

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Re: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines

 

Mike,

I agree with most of your points.


But I think there is another root cause for engine failures:

You said:

"The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. "

I think those could cause problems.  But there is another stumbling block - the oil must be low enough viscosity to allow the injector to fully vaporize the fuel.  If the fuel is not vaporized thoroughly, the engine will coke up.  At room temperature, the oil will be much more viscous than pump diesel.  By heating the oil, we can lower its viscosity to that of Diesel.   Some people say the oil should be 140F entering the injector pump.  Some people say 160F.  By getting to these elevated temps, we make sure the injector can produce the spray pattern we want.

Some people put heaters on the tubes going to the injectors, to get one last chance to raise the temperature of the oil before it gets to the injector.

To repeat, I feel that even if you have perfectly clean oil, it will not burn properly if it enters the injector at 90F.

(To be sure, the temp at the injector should be high.  Whether higher temps help the injection pump or not is another question.  I don't have an opinion.)

(Reality note: if we could re-engineer the injection pump and/or the injector, that might be a way to properly atomize the oil, but it is easier for us to raise the oil temperature than to change the pump or injector.)

Bobby

On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 9:45 PM, Mag <magconsulting2@yahoo.com> wrote:


I didn't intend to start a debate, but its more than what you can see in the oil. Clear does not mean best. Most older diesels are tough enough you can do whatever you want. Get any oil you want, strain through some jeans, run 24/7, start and stop on it, etc., and you still may get 200,000 this way. Then again, you may not. My post was to simply dispute the "WVO will kill a motor" claims, or decrease the number of miles the motor could have given you. The better you do it, the more miles you likely get. Just like with any other car maintenance.

For anyone interested, (I was interested), there is a lot of physics that go into this. Just like not changing oil every 2,500 miles 40 years ago would likely decrease engine life due to sludge, etc.  Oil technology has improved to the point they are now recommending 5,000 to 7,500, and more on synthetic.

One example;

Common physics proves that when your heat exchanger in your veg tank (mine just a trans cooler attached to heater hoses) gets veg up to 180 (or near whatever your engine coolant temp is) the constant heating and then cooling down when you turn engine off, causes moisture build up in your "clean, settled, de-moistured, or centrifuged" veg again. For this reason I have a 6 gal boat tank as the veg tank. At around 25 miles per gal, I carry 1 extra 5 gal container and refill every other day. Not that many heat up and cool downs before the 6 gal is gone. No 15 or 20 gal tank to linger and collect moisture. Plus, my 5 micron filter near the engine is rated to trap moisture. I have taken longer trips with 3 or 4, 5 gal plastic gas tanks with me. Stopping every 150 miles to refill the tank didn't kill me. 

The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. This freezes the rings in place which then scores cylinder walls, then comes the blow by. Similar issues with bearings, etc. i know I'm preaching to the choir. you can take crystal clear veg, add various chemicals like mineral spirits, turpentine, etc., and that will bind to some of that "invisible stuff" and settle to the bottom of the jar. Then ask yourself "where did that stuff come from".

Best way to avoid this as much as possible is "good veg", no moisture, and as much "bad stuff" filtered as possible, and that's not always what you can "see". I have been studying this stuff for 10 years and the one thing I'm certain of is a million people have a thousand different ways and spend countless hours debating such.  My way with the cent is fairly quick, simple, reasonably backed by science, and most importantly, works for me. Just thought I would share.

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:15 PM, Boyd Wright <bgthegreat@verizon.net> wrote:

 

I use coffee filters and denim cold.  Have a solar holding tank.  No problems here.
 
Boyd

From: Lawrence Rhodes <primobassoon@sbcglobal.net>
To: "diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com" <diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 1:09 PM
Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines
 
Now Mike has a real great setup but he is doing one thing wrong.  To speed things up he heats the oil...WRONG.  The problem with heating the oil is more "stuff" gets through.  I've had many a settled highly heated and refined five gallon jug of oil have silt on the bottom.  Heating while filtering allows more through the filter media.  I cold filter through denim.  I get very little silting after letting filtered oil sit.  If I worry about water I just don't use it.  Settling gets rid of most of the water.  My oil looks crystal clear.  If it's foggy I just don't use it or much of it.  Lawrence Rhodes........ Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines    Posted by: "Mike Glavin" magconsulting2@yahoo.com magconsulting2    Date: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:58 am ((PDT))I too have run veg oil and believe it to be as good as diesel if done right. Mine is run through a centrifuge that claims to filter out particles less than a micron. Regular oil filters are only about 25 microns. It has an engine coolant heat exchanger in the spare tank in the trunk  and a electric heated 5 micron filter before it enters the injectors. I start on diesel and don't switch over until engine coolant is at full temp. About a minute or so before I get to where I'm going, I switch back to diesel to flush the injectors. The 82 300D runs better on veg than diesel. Probably because the cetane level in veg is generally better than diesel. My cost is what ever I pay for the veg and electric for a 2 hour run of a 1/2 hp elect motor and single water heater element per 55 gallons cleaned. Centrifuge is mounted on top on 55 gal barrel. Veg is pumped from the bottom into the cent at 90 psi via the motor. Heating element is inserted into the side of drum with a similar threaded port as a water heater. I have it on a 220 cable that plugs into my dryer outlet. I pick up the veg. Pour through a strainer as I fill the drum. When full I plug in the heater. Come back in about an hour and if it 180-200 deg, I unplug heat and turn on the pump. Come back in 2 hours which equals about 4 passes of oil through the cent. The temp cooks off moisture and thins the oil so dirt can be spun out in the cent. 55 gal of near see through oil no matter the color going in. Unscrew the cover to the cent, wipe out the sludge with a shop rag, good to go another drum. Not counting pickup, about 20 min invested per 55 galMike Glavin573-338-6539






--
Toward freedom,

Bobby Yates Emory

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[diesel_mercedes] HVA/C blower problem cured?

 


Have you yet replaced the blower motor's brushes ? .

-Nate
Rob wrote :
>
> I spoke too soon. There were more issues w/ the A/C controller, in the form of intermittent air blowing, so I swapped out with one from the PAP, which seems to work fine now. If more issues arise, I might splurge on the new one from the MB Classic Center.
>
> I haven't got to the MB turbo yet, as I've been working on my Wife's 240DL Volvo, which now has new suspension all around W/ springs, Bil HDs, alloys, etc. Very nice.
>
> Rob
>

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[diesel_mercedes] Veggie Oil In Diesel Engines

 


Well put , thank you .

-Nate
Mag wrote :
>
> I didn't intend to start a debate, but its more than what you can see in the oil. Clear does not mean best. Most older diesels are tough enough you can do whatever you want. Get any oil you want, strain through some jeans, run 24/7, start and stop on it, etc., and you still may get 200,000 this way. Then again, you may not. My post was to simply dispute the "WVO will kill a motor" claims, or decrease the number of miles the motor could have given you. The better you do it, the more miles you likely get. Just like with any other car maintenance.
>
> For anyone interested, (I was interested), there is a lot of physics that go into this. Just like not changing oil every 2,500 miles 40 years ago would likely decrease engine life due to sludge, etc. Oil technology has improved to the point they are now recommending 5,000 to 7,500, and more on synthetic.
>
> One example;
>
> Common physics proves that when your heat exchanger in your veg tank (mine just a trans cooler attached to heater hoses) gets veg up to 180 (or near whatever your engine coolant temp is) the constant heating and then cooling down when you turn engine off, causes moisture build up in your "clean, settled, de-moistured, or centrifuged" veg again. For this reason I have a 6 gal boat tank as the veg tank. At around 25 miles per gal, I carry 1 extra 5 gal container and refill every other day. Not that many heat up and cool downs before the 6 gal is gone. No 15 or 20 gal tank to linger and collect moisture. Plus, my 5 micron filter near the engine is rated to trap moisture. I have taken longer trips with 3 or 4, 5 gal plastic gas tanks with me. Stopping every 150 miles to refill the tank didn't kill me.
>
> The decrease in engine life is mainly due to moisture and "stuff" in the oil that does not burn clean, thus causes "coking" or carbon build up. This freezes the rings in place which then scores cylinder walls, then comes the blow by. Similar issues with bearings, etc. i know I'm preaching to the choir. you can take crystal clear veg, add various chemicals like mineral spirits, turpentine, etc., and that will bind to some of that "invisible stuff" and settle to the bottom of the jar. Then ask yourself "where did that stuff come from".
>
> Best way to avoid this as much as possible is "good veg", no moisture, and as much "bad stuff" filtered as possible, and that's not always what you can "see". I have been studying this stuff for 10 years and the one thing I'm certain of is a million people have a thousand different ways and spend countless hours debating such. My way with the cent is fairly quick, simple, reasonably backed by science, and most importantly, works for me. Just thought I would share.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:15 PM, Boyd Wright <bgthegreat@...> wrote:
>
> > I use coffee filters and denim cold. Have a solar holding tank. No problems here.
> >
> > Boyd
> >
> > From: Lawrence Rhodes <primobassoon@...>
> > To: "diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com" <diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 1:09 PM
> > Subject: [diesel_mercedes] Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines
> >
> > Now Mike has a real great setup but he is doing one thing wrong. To speed things up he heats the oil...WRONG. The problem with heating the oil is more "stuff" gets through. I've had many a settled highly heated and refined five gallon jug of oil have silt on the bottom. Heating while filtering allows more through the filter media. I cold filter through denim. I get very little silting after letting filtered oil sit. If I worry about water I just don't use it. Settling gets rid of most of the water. My oil looks crystal clear. If it's foggy I just don't use it or much of it. Lawrence Rhodes........ Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines Posted by: "Mike Glavin" magconsulting2@... magconsulting2 Date: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:58 am ((PDT))I too have run veg oil and believe it to be as good as diesel if done right. Mine is run through a centrifuge that claims to filter out particles less than a micron. Regular oil filters are only about 25 microns. It has an engine coolant heat exchanger in the spare tank in the trunk and a electric heated 5 micron filter before it enters the injectors. I start on diesel and don't switch over until engine coolant is at full temp. About a minute or so before I get to where I'm going, I switch back to diesel to flush the injectors. The 82 300D runs better on veg than diesel. Probably because the cetane level in veg is generally better than diesel. My cost is what ever I pay for the veg and electric for a 2 hour run of a 1/2 hp elect motor and single water heater element per 55 gallons cleaned. Centrifuge is mounted on top on 55 gal barrel. Veg is pumped from the bottom into the cent at 90 psi via the motor. Heating element is inserted into the side of drum with a similar threaded port as a water heater. I have it on a 220 cable that plugs into my dryer outlet. I pick up the veg. Pour through a strainer as I fill the drum. When full I plug in the heater. Come back in about an hour and if it 180-200 deg, I unplug heat and turn on the pump. Come back in 2 hours which equals about 4 passes of oil through the cent. The temp cooks off moisture and thins the oil so dirt can be spun out in the cent. 55 gal of near see through oil no matter the color going in. Unscrew the cover to the cent, wipe out the sludge with a shop rag, good to go another drum. Not counting pickup, about 20 min invested per 55 galMike Glavin573-338-6539
> >
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[diesel_mercedes] Re: Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines

 


This is the right way to do it , 99 % of people get lazy and skip steps resulting in dirty fuel...

Or they get lazy and neglect to flush it out those few last minutes .

-Nate
Mike wrote :
>
> I too have run veg oil and believe it to be as good as diesel if done right. Mine is run through a centrifuge that claims to filter out particles less than a micron. Regular oil filters are only about 25 microns. It has an engine coolant heat exchanger in the spare tank in the trunk and a electric heated 5 micron filter before it enters the injectors. I start on diesel and don't switch over until engine coolant is at full temp. About a minute or so before I get to where I'm going, I switch back to diesel to flush the injectors. The 82 300D runs better on veg than diesel. Probably because the cetane level in veg is generally better than diesel. My cost is what ever I pay for the veg and electric for a 2 hour run of a 1/2 hp elect motor and single water heater element per 55 gallons cleaned. Centrifuge is mounted on top on 55 gal barrel. Veg is pumped from the bottom into the cent at 90 psi via the motor. Heating element is inserted into the side of drum with a similar threaded port as a water heater. I have it on a 220 cable that plugs into my dryer outlet. I pick up the veg. Pour through a strainer as I fill the drum. When full I plug in the heater. Come back in about an hour and if it 180-200 deg, I unplug heat and turn on the pump. Come back in 2 hours which equals about 4 passes of oil through the cent. The temp cooks off moisture and thins the oil so dirt can be spun out in the cent. 55 gal of near see through oil no matter the color going in. Unscrew the cover to the cent, wipe out the sludge with a shop rag, good to go another drum. Not counting pickup, about 20 min invested per 55 gal
>
> Mike Glavin
> 573-338-6539
>
>

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[diesel_mercedes] Re: A/C blower problem cured?

 

I spoke too soon. There were more issues w/ the A/C controller, in the form of intermittent air blowing, so I swapped out with one from the PAP, which seems to work fine now. If more issues arise, I might splurge on the new one from the MB Classic Center.

I haven't got to the MB turbo yet, as I've been working on my Wife's 240DL Volvo, which now has new suspension all around W/ springs, Bil HDs, alloys, etc. Very nice.

Rob
MB '85 300D CA
Volvo '86 240DL (wagon)
Garden Grove, CA

==

--- In diesel_mercedes@yahoogroups.com, Aleph93 <aleph93@...> wrote:
>
> I think that I cured the A/C blower problems I've been experiencing off
> and on this year. After getting the A/C compressor replaced, the blower
> control has been iffy, and yesterday just quit. I took out the
> controller, and removed the door covering the circuit board, and
> re-soldered the connections, like folks do with the cruse control box.
> It seems to work fine now, though I'll give it some time to be sure.
>
> I took a couple pics of the circuit board and uploaded them to our photo
> files:
> Rob-'85 300D Garden Grove
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/diesel_mercedes/photos/album/326446776/pic/list
> They'll show up for awhile on "new photos" on the site too.
>
> The radio stopped working too, so back in there to deal with that.
> (guessing loose wire)
> Better to have these issues close to home, then out on the road.
>
> Rob
> '85 300D
> Garden Grove, CA
>

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[diesel_mercedes] Re: Re : Veggie Oil KILLS Diesel Engines

 

I think the Davco 234+ filter is adequate to provide enough protection to the engine from foreign matter and water. It has a coolant heat exchanger, an electric heater, a sump to collect water that precipitates out when the fuel is heated. You can get filter elements in various micron sizes, and some that block water if you want to. Filter elements are around $10 apiece and will last 2000 miles if you are a little bit particular about your fuel. I don't think heating the fuel causes any more contaminants to flow through the filter. Heating contaminants does not cause them to shrink, and the filters block contaminants based on size, not temperature. So get yerself a Davco 234+ and then choose your fuel wisely, and you'll be fine IMHO.

YMMV.

Jim

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